If you would have to start again…

CraigHollander

Blues Newbie
Hi Braylon

All of us have things that work for us . What happens though is it is very easy to become Tab Dependent. Orchestra yes play from sheet music but bar band professional rockers blues players do not read tab when performing they have. it memorized and when you memorize I would think you really have the lick ingrained in your head and fingers. Maybe I was unclear not playing with tab or video is after you have the general timing and have the notes memorized . Griff I think does say in multiple videos to memorize the licks.

I think what was happening to me was even when I memorized the licks I was sometimes screwing up timing. The licks are movable as to when you are improvising what beat they start on but some things sound better then other I suggest when trying to get comfortable with the backing tracks what works for me is use the same starting beat as griff uses initially for that lick .

What I added recently that is helping me as some put it feel the pulse and the chord tones by ear to stay tighter is what I said above . Listen to the sound of the lick from start to end point . Once I learn it to me I just think of the BPM speed 1 2 3 4 I know if its triplets sixteenth or sextuplet or eighths etc so since I have it memorized at that point if I start at the right place and I listened to the speed of the song and I have the sound of especially the tonal center in my head because a ton of this resolves to the root or if not the root where its got to get to it kinda starting to just work?

I forgot earlier something so easy that I never did before but helped me a ton. I was tapping with the song by lifting the toe end of my foot up and down. I noticed that I think Griff lifts his heal and whole leg comes up? I tried felt weird at first but... holy cow for some reason I am playing more in time that way. Anything that works for you do it. works means you make progress if no progress it aint working . We all need to self check ourselves are we using practice time efficiently or else it's just twiddling with no progress? So yes I agree use tab and videos to learn the lick to the point you can play it with Griff audio or video and then looking at tab without griff but....after you need to play it both totally on your own while tapping and counting it out and with backing track if you can do that you know it if not you dont. If you play to much with tab and dont try to do it without tab you become to dependent. Apologies for any confusion . I am distracted by Taylor Swift at the KC game their up 17 to 7 .
 

PeterSchroeder

Munich, Germany
Wow, I am overwhelmed by the massive amount of response. I guess a lot of my frustration really comes from lack of basics and the "play something" problem. When I started I didn´t really focus on that, with all the YT tutorials around and the quick initial results on the electric guitar. I never learnt in instrument before and seem to miss the whole campfire background where a lot of guitar players seem to come from. Might be a good idea to get going with this. Strumming, ryhthm, counting, chords, patterns. Listen to and play music. How would success look like for me ? Grab a guitar, no matter whether it is acoustic or electric and be able to play something which other people - and myself - like to listen to. With or without backing track. Whole songs, not isolated riffs or licks. Andfind people to play with. Not publicly, yet, way too shy at the moment.

Any recommendations on where to go (on the internet) to get into shape with the basics before I head to Strumming and Rhythm mastery (which I fortunately got from a GT) ?
 

dvs

Green Mountain Blues
Any recommendations on where to go (on the internet) to get into shape with the basics before I head to Strumming and Rhythm mastery (which I fortunately got from a GT) ?
I think you're already in the best place I ever found for that, to be honest.

Having said that, I also visit Justinguitar sometimes for songs. Brian at ActiveMelodyGuitar does some interesting things with soloing and rhythms.

Have at it!
 

tommytubetone

Great Lakes
the whole campfire background where a lot of guitar players seem to come from. Might be a good idea to get going with this.
That's how I started anyway. Those Campfire chords or cowboy chords will serve you well even as you progress. When playing with others (highly recommended), you'll want to play in a different part of the fretboard than the other guitarist, so they can be used there. Check out the video I posted in the lounge titled "she continues to get better". Dion is playing a basic Am chord every time they do a closeup.
As has been mentioned numerous times, play with others. It seems I was always doing that when I wasn't home working on a specific skill. Hang out at jams or open mikes and meet some people even if you aren't planning on playing right away. You might find a jam partner. (y)
 

Paleo

Student Of The Blues
Any recommendations on where to go (on the internet) to get into shape with the basics before I head to Strumming and Rhythm mastery (which I fortunately got from a GT) ?
That course is “the basics”. You don’t need to go somewhere else first.

Get on it! (y)
 
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CraigHollander

Blues Newbie




Peter,

Yes massive response but as I said yesterday we are coming together much more because us older guys are starting to realize that the main problem with quickly learning is 2 fold and not difficult to understand. People have the same habits including all the time I wasted myself. They pick up guitar and when they can use tabs and play a part of a song they like they naturally get excited and then they want to know more and do it again .So they learn all these little parts of various songs but never become a real player then frustration then they put guitar town. If you ever go into a music store and people are plugged in testing guitars you will notice even middle aged guys they are twiddling a few chords a few notes never really playing a song or sounding right. This is no ones fault other than very few teachers to this day you stumble on stress how to practice. The other frustration is knowing what techniques like bends and pull off are but not being able to make them sound right and execute. My friend you are now on the right path please report back to the group in 1 month after you work on this stage of strumming and playing whole songs . It is going to encourage others who come on the forum.

This is why I think starting with Strumming memorizing a whole song and playing it to family or friends is going to get you really going. Including building your timing. Starting out right with solos will be soon after but is more difficult and you are looking for a win right now.

I have carefully searched so many acoustic sites (I play with my electric) for solid accurate tab I lost count. These 3 are the best collections I have found. I also put a primer on how to lock in with drums and get could sound out of your strum. If you watch Griff or any of the 3 guys above they do this. Watch that how to video 1st .

Here is my suggestions that worked for me

1- Griff in course talks about the world's greatest most popular strum. The bruce songs almost everyone of them uses this strum and maybe 4 or 5 others so this will show you to sound good you only need a half dozen patterns. I am not huge Bruce guy but found the way this guy teaches it is the easiest of the 3 sites to start on and I would go to the playlist Darkness on the edge of Town tab do like 4 songs from that one there are some of his biggest hits and very good strumming songs. I suggest Darkness on the edge of town , prove it all night , badlands Adam raised a cain and the promised land try some of those because they have different patterns different feel watch each 1st you will see what I am saying. You may not even like Bruce it doesnt matter your trying to quickly master skills its more fun then playing non song exercises.

2- Do not jump around. You can play the chords behind the easy short solos for now dont worry about that . or behind the sax solos. To memorize quickly what I did is this . Start a word doc and right the order of the parts and under it the chords but without the strum patterns in whatever order for that song they fall .
intro
verse
chorus
bridge
outro


Play along with the instructor and tab after watching the how to strum video above and watching the video straight through paying attention to his left and right hands motions. Try to be consistent how he does it. Also you dont really stop the up or down motion of strumming you just hit or miss strings that is very important .After each play through this guy breaks it. down in detail . How he does it.

One technical thing that helped me is The right hand is keeping you in time so strum at consistent speed do not stop your either hitting or missing strings if you screw up keep going with right hand. Your left hand to keep in sync needs to do the chord changes at the right time quickly and smooth. I think the biggest help with that is Practice putting all the fingers down in the chord shape like G at the same time not like many do at beginning staggered. It better to hit a little bit of open string while doing this then to slow right hand to let you put down your fingers slowly. Watch this guy and griff play this is going to make you sound better.

Once you can play it all through with him and tab reasonably well. Take out word doc and try to play it through without video . Since you now dont have the strum pattern in front of you it forces you to try to remember it . Dont panic think because there is likely only 2 or 3 patterns in each song and.... the parts are repeating 1st chorus and 2nd chorus same thing right you can do it?

Now lets say you now can play through without tab but looking at the order of parts and chords . Now you are going to try to do it on your own.
It helps here to know the lyrics if possible ( you dont have to but I found it helped me ) What I am thinking is Start with intro then okay lyrics I am thinking of in my head show me how many times through to play the pattern because now I am anticipating hey its time for the change to chorus .

Do not go on to the next song until you have a whole song down even if it takes a week or a month the next one will be faster.

Like any memorizing do not do this for 5 hours over and over. Maybe work on 1 part or 2 a day intro verse then chorus bridge. You will not memorize if you play it to many times one sitting but you can play in morning wait play afternoon wait play night if you want to speed learning have to spread it out.

After you have it down play for a friend or family member. Note that some are exact to original recording some are live versions stay with studio recording versions so you can then play along with recording without tab or anything or by yourself.

After Bruce you have so many different artists on the other 2 sides not everything but enough. Make a goal to learn the songs you then like the most stay away initially to ones with solos or fingerpicking stick with strumming for now and learn total of 10 songs.

Your counting your rhythm you happiness and being able to perform whole songs will get you ready for the next steps.



Good Luck
 

Elio

Student Of The Blues
Wow, I am overwhelmed by the massive amount of response. I guess a lot of my frustration really comes from lack of basics and the "play something" problem. When I started I didn´t really focus on that, with all the YT tutorials around and the quick initial results on the electric guitar. I never learnt in instrument before and seem to miss the whole campfire background where a lot of guitar players seem to come from. Might be a good idea to get going with this. Strumming, ryhthm, counting, chords, patterns. Listen to and play music. How would success look like for me ? Grab a guitar, no matter whether it is acoustic or electric and be able to play something which other people - and myself - like to listen to. With or without backing track. Whole songs, not isolated riffs or licks. Andfind people to play with. Not publicly, yet, way too shy at the moment.

Any recommendations on where to go (on the internet) to get into shape with the basics before I head to Strumming and Rhythm mastery (which I fort
unately got from a GT) ?

Griff actually did a video on exactly this a few years ago. His suggested approach was essentially to just grab a Hal Leonard song book and dive in.

For the basics the only step back would probably be Griff's Beginning Blues Guitar course, but it sounds like you are past that, so my suggestion would be Strumming and Rhythm Mastery. At the same time, you could start working on specific songs.
 

Elwood

Blues
I musta seen some different dancers. :rolleyes: Anyway, this thread reminded me of a tune that I made up and posted (way back when) that addresses this very scenario. I still can't say it any better. My blues,.mp3

Please forgive my indiscretion in re-posting this, the devil made me do it.
Now the stinking link works. The tune I made up (My Blues) says what I meant when I said if I had to start over, I might just learn to dance. Probably easier just to go with the flow. :)
 

PapaRaptor

Father Vyvian O'Blivion
Staff member
Now the stinking link works. The tune I made up (My Blues) says what I meant when I said if I had to start over, I might just learn to dance. Probably easier just to go with the flow. :)
Not here. It still takes me to my own DB account.
 

Elwood

Blues
Not here. It still takes me to my own DB account.
I can't see for all the egg on my face. Dang!!! I thought it was working. Thanks for the bad news Papa! I do appreciate it. I already tested a few things (like I did earlier when I thought it was working) and it still sucks. I have written back to my new friends at dropbox. Dang!
 

Elwood

Blues
Now the stinking link works. The tune I made up (My Blues) says what I meant when I said if I had to start over, I might just learn to dance. Probably easier just to go with the flow. :)
as long as your stinking sharing service will play nice. Maybe this works?


that's really "My Blues" under a sneaky moniker. :sneaky:
 

Silicon Valley Tom

It makes me happpy to play The Blues!
Do you want to play for your own enjoyment or play with a group?

Acoustic, electric, or both?

I would suggest setting an achievable goal and define the path to accomplish it.

Do not make it complex.

Keep a log of your progress.

Start with techniques!

Chose a song you like.

Record yourself from time to time.

Redefine your goals as needed.

For many years I have said that I feel that 85% of music teachers are incompetent! In reality, I think the number is closer to 99%!

There will be a time when you will become your own teacher.

Tom
 

Elwood

Blues
I get Link Deleted by the owner.
That is because files I send with my new pCloud account play for 90 - 120 seconds and then loop back to the start.
I try to use dropbox and I can't copy a link successfully to send a tune.

I did absolutely nothing, nothing, and just like that I can't send a tune to anyone.

Insert long string of really bad words here. :mad: I believe this is the definition of frustration. After a cup of coffee I will try to open communications with both sharing platform to see why oh why this is happening.

Thanks for trying to listen Mike.

I have now sent appeals for help off to both Dropbox and pCloud.
 
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TexBill

Blues in Texas
I am currently working on learning Triads at different positions which involve Root position, 1st inversion, and second inversions of sets 3-2-1 and 4-3-2.

Also, attempting to learn where other notes of a different key, i.e., C or D or E or G and etc. may been located withing a very small area of the fretboard. For example, if playing Gmaj on 3-2-1 at 3rd fret. where are others located in the area not more than 4 frets away.

This is like learning to play all over again to me. To those that have way more experience than myself, it may not be such a big endeavor.

So, to those who have started over again and shared your experiences, does learning somethin new give one the sense of a new beginning. Or is it just gaining knowledge of the instrument and music principles?
 

Elio

Student Of The Blues
I am currently working on learning Triads at different positions which involve Root position, 1st inversion, and second inversions of sets 3-2-1 and 4-3-2.

Also, attempting to learn where other notes of a different key, i.e., C or D or E or G and etc. may been located withing a very small area of the fretboard. For example, if playing Gmaj on 3-2-1 at 3rd fret. where are others located in the area not more than 4 frets away.

This is like learning to play all over again to me. To those that have way more experience than myself, it may not be such a big endeavor.

So, to those who have started over again and shared your experiences, does learning somethin new give one the sense of a new beginning. Or is it just gaining knowledge of the instrument and music principles?
For me, making a breakthrough into something new is almost always like a new beginning because it suddenly opens up all kinds of new possibilities that I hadn't previously imagined.

As kind of a related example to yours, about 10+ years ago, my daughter decided she wanted to learn to play so I found an instructor in my neighborhood who was a friend of a friend, and quite good. After a few months, she decided to move on to other interests but since I had pre-paid several lessons, he let me take her place. One of the rhythm guitar exercises he gave me turned out to be really valuable. He had me take a song with many chord changes I had been using to practice comping. My tendency was to always pick a 6th string root barre chords for consistency, regardless of where they fell on the fretboard. His twist was that he had me switch between 6th string roots and 5th string roots (including little chords), based upon which one was physically closest to the chord I had just played. The result was that it got me thinking in terms of choosing the most accessible location. Looking back, it really improved my economy of motion and opened the door to faster and more complicated rhythms since I didn't have to work quite so hard to keep up.

Unfortunately, those breakthroughs are hard to find, sometimes :cool:
 
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