If you would have to start again…

[TexBill]

@Elio that is precisely how I perceived the onset of my attempt at Triads. The economy of motion is one of my goals in learning Triads.

I have mentioned multiple times my exposure to a horn in jr-hi band. The instructor (band leader) always had his baton tapping on the podium/music stand whenever we were playing in the classroom. That has always been my foundation in timing and to this day I have decent rhythm when strumming guitar. As evidenced by comments from a friend who is a very good player.

The strumming aspect of playing is not a long standing event in my electric guitar repertoire. When I first began, I was taught how to play lead parts of songs of the day. I never knew what strumming was all about. Then in my second attempt at electric (40 yrs later) my instructor built on my lead experience and never emphasized strumming. So fast forward another 15 yrs and I am now exposed to all sorts of techniques via BGU.. Go figure I still have reasonably steady rhythm.

One never knows what the reaction to a new venture may bring. Experiences in life have twists and turns and we my discover an unusual or new sensation when we do.....

 

[Elwood]

he had me switch between 6th string roots and 5th string roots (including little chords), based upon which one was physically closest to the chord I had just played. The result was that it got me thinking in terms of choosing the most accessible location. Looking back, it really improved my economy of motion and opened the door

That is very much the same experience that I had learning from Griff's materials (another round of appreciation for @Griff here!). The other thing that I found is that learning chords that don't start on the low E string opens up using chords, and inversions that flow along with the melody. Learning more chord positions and learning the pentatonic boxes has done lots to get me so I can get around tunes better, and learn them much easier. Since I have relative simple goals of just trying to learn some tunes to sit and play, these tools are invaluable!

 

[patb]

Papa hit it on the head but in two respects.

When I read “ Why are you doing this?” it hit me squarely but not only in the way intended. I have been asking myself for some time
“Why the hell am I doing this?”

First, I ask myself why I am sitting alone in my music room day after day with no prospect of anyone hearing it or playing with other people much less those that are better than I and have any interest in the blues. I live in a small town with little opportunity to join others. The people tend be cliquish and the musical interest rarely goes beyond country. I heard some Eagles and Marshall Tucker live last month and concluded they were from out of town. I can’t be the only one in this situation. How do others deal with it. I recently joined a fraternal organization in hopes of meeting some musicians. I’m desperate.

Second, piled on the above, I am struggling with “ Why am I continuing to do this when I am sorely disappointed with my progress?” He then went on to describe what I should be doing to improve . No argument with any of it. I’m often the worst of students. ADD poster child. Perfect for you tube.

Over a period of about 12 years of interruptions by extended work travel (since retired) and illness I have 2 to 3 years of serious effort .

My original goals were to solo and play slide mixed with conventional fretting of scales and chords in standard tuning. I had an unrealistic view of guitar in a band. Playing rhythm just didn’t register. I have completed several of Griff’s courses and can play respectable rhythm but just can’t pull it together to solo .

I once worked intensively on strumming/ singing Bobby McGee, Proud Mary etc for ~ 3 months with a private instructor and definitely improved, burned out , and didn’t touch the guitar for 3 months. Aside from that I never spent much time learning whole songs as I didn’t have much opportunity to play them except alone in my room.

Another 3 months on slide courses. Improved technique and understanding of standard and open tunings. Can’t pull it together.

While Papa makes several good points and I’m working through them, I’m totally bogged down in the S**t with the first issue overshadowing it all. I didn’t intend to go on this long but there it is.

Thanks to all who contributed here. I appreciate your good thoughts and experience and your time to post.

Pat

 

[artyman]

Can I suggest you poke your head in the Virtual jam Room and join in down there as a start. Are there any open mic nights locally, or perhaps give busking at the local shopping mall and see if you get any nibbles or comments that may lead to making some connections.

 

[Paleo]

I’d start with Griff.

 

[patb]

I’d start with Griff.

What does that mean?
I never left Griff except to waste time on you tube.

 

[CraigHollander]

We have all to various extent felt the love /hate frustration of trying to play the way we really want to play guitar.

The virtual jam the guys do here is likely a quick fix to just having people to play with and you can find others to virtually jam with by video zoom FaceTime whatever both here and online in general.

As to the frustration and playing ability challenges

if you have seen my post you know why I am jumping in because I have felt your pain. So have many who come on. Tried in teens few years gave up in frustration tried in my 30s for 2 years gave up in frustration however ... dont give up because

Even after working with Griff course for last 3 years I was still held back from becoming fully professional player but... On my guitar awakening day Dec 19th 2023 It suddenly clicked in and now over last 46 days and about 24 days I practiced for an hour a day so only 24 hours of practice I made more progress then in last 3 years or any other attempt. Every time I practice I see and hear the progress.

You sound really down so you are welcome to contact me direct I will explain. My previous post are all about this kind of thing but will likely just confuse as not always concise enough in expressing my points . I am happy to do what no one did for the teenage me and reach out and help you if you want if I can do it anyone can. You can also do it very very quickly. I love all Griffs courses and use them every day for various practice but I have found ways to utilize a few different resources to supplement how I use Griffs vast info to break out and constantly improve. I am only limited now to when I can practice as I work and family. But one more thing when you enjoy practice its because you made real tangible progress when you hate playing and cant pick up guitar its because you are not happy with progress . So let's get you moving forward. If you want to see what helped me you can reach out direct so I dont drive the regulars crazy.

See below this is from my rock and metal course forum I belong hit just today like yours you are far far from alone feeling like this Tons of people are right now reaching out to say to her you are not alone we all have it happen and ben the instructor is giving advice. This is not unusual it can be handled.

The mental slump​

I need to burst out. Been silent for months. Getting back to playing has never felt this mentally hard. It's been eight months. First, my wrists went very sore and had to take a break. Then I was sick, very busy with life and work. Now I am recovering from covid-19. Its been exhausting. All the tunes are playing in my head and trying to play guitar feels like dragging a ten ton concrete block. And my middle aged brain is going through the age crisis, can I still learn A and B and C, why didnt I play enough when I was in my 20's etc etc yadiyadiyaa... Fucking hell. I feel like I dropped in a hole. Nothing else makes me feel like this, love/hate guitar relationship. What a mean, hard instrument to learn. I seem to go through all the worst possible insight enemies that Ben has been talking about. Now browsing all my tall, dusty practise material piles. Where the hell even to begin?

 

[BobErnst194]

It's not fun for me, and of all things I wish I had done as a younger man, counting is number one.
I can grasp the concept and do it very slowly, but have not been able to bring it up to even half speed.
Granted it isn't as critical for strumming and rhythm, but my goals are to not necessarily solo, but fills and turnarounds (which should be easy) that I can do, but if I try to play with someone else, I screw us both up still.
I haven't given up, but it's the one thing that I am not making progress on that screws up my progress on the things I want.
Oh, and I couldn't find a "frustration" emoji.

I'm right there with ya on the counting. It (lack of knowing it) lost me the two auditions I had "back in the day". But at least we drank lots of beer afterward! Rock n Roll!

 

[CraigHollander]

I am about to upload a scaled down cheat sheet on CAGED which is all about moving between chords and licks So if you you want to strum and insert then turnarounds and then strum it will help. Over all I am doing it because like you I could not pull off as teen and quit I always loved music and wanted to play and hated that I couldn't do it properly. Now I am gaining . Your problem is not that you cant do it its that you trust me think you are practicing right but you are are not . 1st when look for when I put up the CAGE shortcuts on the CAGED thread and wipe your mind as you are describing a negative feedback loop that we all put ourselves in sometimes. I finally was able to break out and learn each time I practice just this past DEC 19th. I post only to try to help people who post stuff just like you You are not the only one. I am telling you if I fixed it you can to. Best The Scientist

 

[Grateful_Ed]

Upon further scrutiny and re-reading the posts in this and other threads, the counting while still the problem is a result of poor memorization of the music I'm trying to count. While partially remembering and partially trying to read the tab, I simply can't read, count out loud and play the notes. This "Ah ha" moment for me is probably a "duh" moment for the rest of the members here.
Still frustrating but at least I have an idea where to concentrate more effort... then on with the dreaded counting.
I can actually envision a point where I don't have to count out loud anymore.

 

[snarf]

I need to go back and read this thread. It looks like it has a lot of good stuff in it. Here are the four things I would tell myself.

1. Get a teacher. Online or in person. But get a teacher and work their program. That way goals are realistic and it's easier to maintain focus.
2. Don't fixate on rhythm and lead. At some point, those lines blur because there's some rhythm in the lead and some lead in the rhythm. It's all still guitar playing.
3. Never turn down an opportunity to play with others, especially those that are more experienced. And see if you can spot something that you can learn from them.
4. Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The fact that you're the best player your friends know probably just means you're the only player they know.

 

[BobErnst194]

We have all to various extent felt the love /hate frustration of trying to play the way we really want to play guitar.

The virtual jam the guys do here is likely a quick fix to just having people to play with and you can find others to virtually jam with by video zoom FaceTime whatever both here and online in general.

As to the frustration and playing ability challenges

if you have seen my post you know why I am jumping in because I have felt your pain. So have many who come on. Tried in teens few years gave up in frustration tried in my 30s for 2 years gave up in frustration however ... dont give up because

Even after working with Griff course for last 3 years I was still held back from becoming fully professional player but... On my guitar awakening day Dec 19th 2023 It suddenly clicked in and now over last 46 days and about 24 days I practiced for an hour a day so only 24 hours of practice I made more progress then in last 3 years or any other attempt. Every time I practice I see and hear the progress.

You sound really down so you are welcome to contact me direct I will explain. My previous post are all about this kind of thing but will likely just confuse as not always concise enough in expressing my points . I am happy to do what no one did for the teenage me and reach out and help you if you want if I can do it anyone can. You can also do it very very quickly. I love all Griffs courses and use them every day for various practice but I have found ways to utilize a few different resources to supplement how I use Griffs vast info to break out and constantly improve. I am only limited now to when I can practice as I work and family. But one more thing when you enjoy practice its because you made real tangible progress when you hate playing and cant pick up guitar its because you are not happy with progress . So let's get you moving forward. If you want to see what helped me you can reach out direct so I dont drive the regulars crazy.

See below this is from my rock and metal course forum I belong hit just today like yours you are far far from alone feeling like this Tons of people are right now reaching out to say to her you are not alone we all have it happen and ben the instructor is giving advice. This is not unusual it can be handled.

The mental slump​

I need to burst out. Been silent for months. Getting back to playing has never felt this mentally hard. It's been eight months. First, my wrists went very sore and had to take a break. Then I was sick, very busy with life and work. Now I am recovering from covid-19. Its been exhausting. All the tunes are playing in my head and trying to play guitar feels like dragging a ten ton concrete block. And my middle aged brain is going through the age crisis, can I still learn A and B and C, why didnt I play enough when I was in my 20's etc etc yadiyadiyaa... Fucking hell. I feel like I dropped in a hole. Nothing else makes me feel like this, love/hate guitar relationship. What a mean, hard instrument to learn. I seem to go through all the worst possible insight enemies that Ben has been talking about. Now browsing all my tall, dusty practise material piles. Where the hell even to begin?

Thank you for putting in this much effort o reach out and offer your similar experiences. I am promising myself once again that I'll structure my practicing to make stronger and faster gains. I've barely even scratched the surface of Griffs all access site, But I sure do like what I've seen. I'll get on that virtual jam room one day for sure.

 

[BobErnst194]

I am about to upload a scaled down cheat sheet on CAGED which is all about moving between chords and licks So if you you want to strum and insert then turnarounds and then strum it will help. Over all I am doing it because like you I could not pull off as teen and quit I always loved music and wanted to play and hated that I couldn't do it properly. Now I am gaining . Your problem is not that you cant do it its that you trust me think you are practicing right but you are are not . 1st when look for when I put up the CAGE shortcuts on the CAGED thread and wipe your mind as you are describing a negative feedback loop that we all put ourselves in sometimes. I finally was able to break out and learn each time I practice just this past DEC 19th. I post only to try to help people who post stuff just like you You are not the only one. I am telling you if I fixed it you can to. Best The Scientist

Where would i find that?

 

[Paleo]

Where would i find that?

How to use triads - target chord tones and play back and forth and in between chord tones

All When I got into this topic on Feb 1st triggered by once again finding the 1 "video" that opened up my mind I made some post and lost all of you I am sure. I have kept at it to make it simpler for me and to share to all who can really use this. Starting this thread for this topic only ...

bluesguitarunleashed.com

Reply #4
Reply #21 top of page 2 for corrected versions

 

[patb]

Papa hit it on the head but in two respects.

When I read “ Why are you doing this?” it hit me squarely but not only in the way intended. I have been asking myself for some time
“Why the hell am I doing this?”

First, I ask myself why I am sitting alone in my music room day after day with no prospect of anyone hearing it or playing with other people much less those that are better than I and have any interest in the blues. I live in a small town with little opportunity to join others. The people tend be cliquish and the musical interest rarely goes beyond country. I heard some Eagles and Marshall Tucker live last month and concluded they were from out of town. I can’t be the only one in this situation. How do others deal with it. I recently joined a fraternal organization in hopes of meeting some musicians. I’m desperate.

Second, piled on the above, I am struggling with “ Why am I continuing to do this when I am sorely disappointed with my progress?” He then went on to describe what I should be doing to improve . No argument with any of it. I’m often the worst of students. ADD poster child. Perfect for you tube.

Over a period of about 12 years of interruptions by extended work travel (since retired) and illness I have 2 to 3 years of serious effort .

My original goals were to solo and play slide mixed with conventional fretting of scales and chords in standard tuning. I had an unrealistic view of guitar in a band. Playing rhythm just didn’t register. I have completed several of Griff’s courses and can play respectable rhythm but just can’t pull it together to solo .

I once worked intensively on strumming/ singing Bobby McGee, Proud Mary etc for ~ 3 months with a private instructor and definitely improved, burned out , and didn’t touch the guitar for 3 months. Aside from that I never spent much time learning whole songs as I didn’t have much opportunity to play them except alone in my room.

Another 3 months on slide courses. Improved technique and understanding of standard and open tunings. Can’t pull it together.

While Papa makes several good points and I’m working through them, I’m totally bogged down in the S**t with the first issue overshadowing it all. I didn’t intend to go on this long but there it is.

Thanks to all who contributed here. I appreciate your good thoughts and experience and your time to post.

Pat

Update. I decided to do SOMETHING, damn near anything, to get out of the paralysis. Following Papa's guidelines on 2-6 I chose BGU2 Solo example #2 ( I blew through it originally cause I didn't like the key of B and Solo 3 was more interesting. Then I went off in about 6 more directions). Anyway, I set the goal to memorize it by March 1. I currently have licks 1-5, mostly. Oddly, I'm finding that memorizing it with counting is easier and helps string the licks together. I've been counting for 2+ years . Incidentally, those of you who think they can play without counting, try Rhythm Figures for Lead....
Wife is waiting for a new knee so I'm doing extra duty cooking, shopping, cleaning, dog etc. for the next couple months. Practice is erratic but I'm doing something and feeling good about it..
Again, thanks to all that replied.
Pat
I'll post again 3-1
Pat

 

[BraylonJennings]

Update. I decided to do SOMETHING, damn near anything, to get out of the paralysis. Following Papa's guidelines on 2-6 I chose BGU2 Solo example #2 ( I blew through it originally cause I didn't like the key of B and Solo 3 was more interesting. Then I went off in about 6 more directions). Anyway, I set the goal to memorize it by March 1. I currently have licks 1-5, mostly. Oddly, I'm finding that memorizing it with counting is easier and helps string the licks together. I've been counting for 2+ years . Incidentally, those of you who think they can play without counting, try Rhythm Figures for Lead....
Wife is waiting for a new knee so I'm doing extra duty cooking, shopping, cleaning, dog etc. for the next couple months. Practice is erratic but I'm doing something and feeling good about it..
Again, thanks to all that replied.
Pat
I'll post again 3-1
Pat

Solo 2 is a great one to learn. Between the rhythm part, which is cool, and the solo, and the vocal (which is relatively simple), it's a great chance to fit all the elements in to a song. Good luck, I also live in a rural area and chances to play live blues rock aren't easy to come by. Driving an hour to play or recording tunes on my daw are my main options.

 

[TexBill]

@patb man can I relate to what you are going through.

I live in a town with approximately 100K+. We have some local clubs, restaurants and etc. that have live music on occasion. I am not aware of any so called open mic nites for Blues at all. If there are any open mic places, they would most likely be either country or rock.

Going a step beyond the above scenario, I have a friend who teaches private lessons. At various times over the past several years, he has been in a few different bands. Most of which played at small clubs or restaurants with stages or some other venues that are private. He no longer is part of any band at the moment. Mainly due to travel time and distance to only get paid less than he was accustomed to making before Covid started shutting down most of those type of events.

Like you described, I have no one to play in front of. My wife has a major bobby that has turned into a part time (full days 3 times a week) job. She teaches classes periodically at the same shop, also. So when I am practicing, it is just me in my room and she in her room when at home. The days that she is at the shop, I am here alone. So I totally get what you are feeling with respect to not having anyone to play guitar with.....

 

[JPsuff]

@patb man can I relate to what you are going through.

I live in a town with approximately 100K+. We have some local clubs, restaurants and etc. that have live music on occasion. I am not aware of any so called open mic nites for Blues at all. If there are any open mic places, they would most likely be either country or rock.

Going a step beyond the above scenario, I have a friend who teaches private lessons. At various times over the past several years, he has been in a few different bands. Most of which played at small clubs or restaurants with stages or some other venues that are private. He no longer is part of any band at the moment. Mainly due to travel time and distance to only get paid less than he was accustomed to making before Covid started shutting down most of those type of events.

Like you described, I have no one to play in front of. My wife has a major bobby that has turned into a part time (full days 3 times a week) job. She teaches classes periodically at the same shop, also. So when I am practicing, it is just me in my room and she in her room when at home. The days that she is at the shop, I am here alone. So I totally get what you are feeling with respect to not having anyone to play guitar with.....

I get that.
Here on Long Island, there are some places with open mic nights. But from what I 've heard from players and one teacher, they mostly end up being shred-fests. Having lived here all my life, I can definitely see that being the case.
I'm sure if I really went into search mode I could probably find something somewhere, but the ones I've heard of that are worth the effort are way into the next county and frankly, I'm not digging the idea of driving 30-plus miles for a chance to play on one or two tunes and then call it a night.
I'd be interested in joining a band, but the blues bands that DO exist are pretty much booked in the few bluesy clubs or bars that still exist, so the venue opportunities are slim to none unless you have a resume or a hook.
If I was still working at the studio like back in the day, I'm sure I could find a guy who knows a guy and maybe hook up with a band. But I've been away from that scene for a long time and the place is completely different from what I remember.
But to be honest, my tastes lean more towards Fusion and other Jazz-based music and experimenting with that and eventually getting into recording things in those genres is what keeps me interested. But even without that, I just love playing!

 

[tommytubetone]

 

[patb]

Solo 2 is a great one to learn. Between the rhythm part, which is cool, and the solo, and the vocal (which is relatively simple), it's a great chance to fit all the elements in to a song. Good luck, I also live in a rural area and chances to play live blues rock aren't easy to come by. Driving an hour to play or recording tunes on my daw are my main options.

What vocal?
Thanks
Pat